Change in Major of Mons

Vincent,
I can easily understand the difficult situations. In a small sport/game it's impossible to have so many active people that the Board members are not players, organisers of events etc. It's much worse than Jekyll and Hyde, and I think Olivier has done correctly (to minimize misunderstandings) to distance the Sports Director from this forum, and only write here as an organiser.

I can't agree more!

Vincent hit the point 100%.
There is maybe a conflict in interests, but the big difference between the previous board(s) and the current board is that the previous board(s) had its priority in being board member of FISTF, so some decisions were even taken against the interest of one of all those other jobs Vincent described.
The current board takes decisions in their own interest, the interest of their association or, the interest of their own club.
Kostas it is more than normal what Vincent wrote and it has nothing to do with splitted personality. If you work in your country you have a different view than when you are working with people of different nationalities, i would even say it is very interesting to work with 5 or 6 people from different countries with different culture and language, it is the same like it is very interesting for you to play tournaments outside of Greece, because you want to meet people from other countries and play against them. You automatically got lots more views on different topics.
I don't think our statutes agree on that what you heard according on the sports department. If Olivier is adopted (it was officially sent by Silvio) then he has a vote till the next congress. If not, the board wouldn't be able to continue, because the sports director is a vice-president of FISTF too.

kechris wrote:Vesa:
For FISTF decisions the problem is the official communication. Sports Departement can't do anything to that with 1 vote on the Board.

Vesa you have bad information. I heard that Olivier cann't vote because he is not elected!
Nobody attitude towards Olivier. We want information by Olivier for the sport department only, no for all FISTF departments.

Vincent
For instance, as a player, I really don't care about Greece but as a FISTF Board member,

Sorry Vincent but you were FISTF president. I don't care your opinion as player, competition manager, belgian vice president, organiser , and as president of your club. I cann't accept a dr Jekyll and mr Hyde opinion. Maybe you confused with so many roles.


1) Major of Mons has its own website. I think this is the proper place to add all information about the Major itself.
2) It is sad for our sport when the BoD hides behind the lack of information.

Second point for Felippe. His comments in target.

I can see and third road for the future. After the "proffesional" road and the "ex-traditional road" more people look for the road to future.

Vesa a fast answer for you.
Forum is our free newspaper.
Everybody can and MUST say his opinion.
If they don't talk BUT THEY READ THIS FORUM this means that or they haven't opinion or they are not proud for their opinion.

kechris wrote:Vesa a fast answer for you.
Forum is our free newspaper.
Everybody can and MUST say his opinion.
If they don't talk BUT THEY READ THIS FORUM this means that or they haven't opinion or they are not proud for their opinion.

Sorry, Kostas, but I disagree with this.

But do other people also have the time to write their own newspaper articles? No, journalists do that. We don't have journalists, and it's not realistic to expect everyone to have time to write his own articles.

It takes a lot of time to be FISTF Director, maybe national director, club organiser, player, idea developer. And on top of this we all have to be journalists?

Forums are the newspapers with readers letters, and those who have the time, energy or possibility are the journalists of our game.

Is it better if Olivier doesn't even read this forum? Then how does he know what people think about things he tries to develop? If you don't have time to write, isn't it better to read than not be interested at all?

The invitation is online at www.ashennuyer.be

VINCENT COPPENOLLE IN THE ITALIAN FORUM:

Of course, if Stefano De Francesco had been in the FISTF Board, he would have been perfect because he is perfect, he's the perfect player (who never cheats or never uses illegal goalkeepers) and who is always telling the truth... :-) :-) :-)

Seriously, there is a lot of bullshit in Stefano's comments:
- the history about Bologna at the Europa CUp in Almada. Maybe it was not perfect from FISTF but is it fait to book plane tickets before you have the confirmation to play the Europa Cup? I don't think so.
- I let a "tourist" play the World Cup? Are you speaking about Singapore's Christopher Soh in the WC in Rotterdam? Christopher Soh is a guy who has done a lot of efforts to start an association in Singapore. He told FISF he was going to be int he Netherlands for the world cup but he was not sure to be able to arrive ind ue time to play. Int he beginning of the tournament, there were 64 players but after 5 minutes int he first game, we realized there was a player missing. Just because it was not good to have a "forfait" int he group stage and because Christopher was coming from Singapore to be at the World Cup, I told him he could play the 3 games in the group stage (but he would not be able to qualify because the goal-average could be a problem). The 3 other players int he group accepted the proposal. Can you say i'm a criminal for that???
- About Sucy, you are totally wrong. Sucy was indeed the most amazing tournament int he world but Mons became bigger because... Garnier stopped organizing the event. Why do people forget to say Garnier stopped organizing his tournament because he was owing money to the city of Sucy? In 2002, Garnier wanted to relaunch a tournament in Sucy. It was a tournament for national teams and he promised prize-mioney for the winners; Belgium came with 2 teams but at the end, we only got 50% of the money we won. After 8 years, we shoud still get 500 Euros from Garnier (which was the money to pay the hotel for the 10 belgian players) but nobody is blaming Garnier for that. Of course the Belgians are the bad boys for that...
- About India, who the hell are you to always come witht he same story? Sometimes I believe you think you are God. Maybe we made mistakes (I admit it) but at least we didn't do things with bad faith. We did things because we thought it was right, not for cheating or, as you think, to get "votes".

The last thing I want to say is that on saturday we had a meeting of the belgian association and our directors agreed that you are not welcome to play in Mons. We can even say you are "persona non grata" in Belgium. Sorry but that's what you deserve.

We are aware that "Stefano De Francesco is not the voice of Italy". When you will have support from your own country, maybe you will be in a position to tell other nations what they should do.

We will have fun without you in our dirty hall with dirty lavatories and we will continue to drink beer without asking your opinion. We are happy like that and we are very happy when you are not there!

THIS IS THE OPINION OF OLIVIERE PERE?
It is important to do, maybe we are still time to cancel the trip

Piero

Everybody is welcome in Mons.

But it's clear that I'm very sad to hear comments made on my person or on my work made by De Francesco. Especially where I can't defend myself, our club, our tournament.

I don't like polemics. And especially public ones. Next time, I'll meet him (in Mons or somewhere else), I hope that we'll have a discussion. Eyes in eyes.

Straight. Respect!

oli wrote:Everybody is welcome in Mons.

But it's clear that I'm very sad to hear comments made on my person or on my work made by De Francesco. Especially where I can't defend myself, our club, our tournament.

I don't like polemics. And especially public ones. Next time, I'll meet him (in Mons or somewhere else), I hope that we'll have a discussion. Eyes in eyes.

Piero, when you are "logic", you have to write what De Francesco wrote in italian because when he's lieing all the time and telling everyone some bullshit, people have to understand why I reply all this...

I'm tired of De Francesco. More than tired!

pierocapponi wrote:

THIS IS THE OPINION OF OLIVIERE PERE?
It is important to do, maybe we are still time to cancel the trip

Pierro you didn't cancel your trip in Greece when Koutroumanos suspend Olympia's players by international tournaments.

Maybe the new BoD have only NEW NAMES AND FACES.
The past is dangerous for the future.

kechris wrote:Maybe the new BoD have only NEW NAMES AND FACES.
The past is dangerous for the future.

Anyway, for me, my time to work for FISTF is definitely over.

oli wrote:Everybody is welcome in Mons.

But it's clear that I'm very sad to hear comments made on my person or on my work made by De Francesco. Especially where I can't defend myself, our club, our tournament.

I don't like polemics. And especially public ones. Next time, I'll meet him (in Mons or somewhere else), I hope that we'll have a discussion. Eyes in eyes.

Piero,

Can you please post my answer (translated in Italian) on Italian forum ?

Thanks in advance.

Oli

oli wrote:

kechris wrote:Maybe the new BoD have only NEW NAMES AND FACES.
The past is dangerous for the future.

Anyway, for me, my time to work for FISTF is definitely over.

Of course my comments was not for you Olivie.
I mean that the members of ex and new BoD fight every time. I mean that the next BoD must work without to explain decisions of past.
It is very possible if Heinz Pierro Stefano Vincent Silvio Alan Thossa Fred relected for every new decision to hear comments for ex decisions.
Maybe a new beggining by point 0 is better after this year.

oli wrote:

oli wrote:Everybody is welcome in Mons.

But it's clear that I'm very sad to hear comments made on my person or on my work made by De Francesco. Especially where I can't defend myself, our club, our tournament.

I don't like polemics. And especially public ones. Next time, I'll meet him (in Mons or somewhere else), I hope that we'll have a discussion. Eyes in eyes.

Piero,

Can you please post my answer (translated in Italian) on Italian forum ?

Thanks in advance.

Oli

Ok, fact.

I am sorry Oliv but i will agree with De Francesco comments.
You organise a fantastic tournament with the best players in world in a small city of Belgium but the toilets are not good enough.
And the afternoon many players are drunk and drinking around the tables.

I played twice in past and i hope to take part again in Mons at future.
I am sure that you will solve these simple problems.

Today it is again a very sad day for FISTF, for Subbuteo, for our hobby.

Thossa wrote:Today it is again a very sad day for FISTF, for Subbuteo, for our hobby.

+1

That's typically for your way of thinking.
Maybe you should try to make the first step and stop that kind of argumentation, it could help a lot. You should try to compare the situation 2 years ago with the current one.
A sports department is structured totally different now with a sports commission, so for the important decisions there are much more people with a voice than at my time.
Some members of the sports commission also could lead the different commissions like rules, material, tournament software, tournament systems, world ranking and database, tournament monitoring and so on, where more people could be involved. That's something totally different than at my time, when we tried but people were not ready to be part of it.
The president has a brighter view on things because of the CoN.
Personally I wouldn't even understand your fear if several people would get the same post they had before, because the situation is very different. In the end there are 2 important post where the number of peope is very limited, that's the marketing director and the sport director. The president is also a post were not many candidates will be available, if there even will be one.

Your problem is that you already build your opinion when you only hear names and you are a person who won't change his opinion again.

kechris wrote:

oli wrote:

kechris wrote:Maybe the new BoD have only NEW NAMES AND FACES.
The past is dangerous for the future.

Anyway, for me, my time to work for FISTF is definitely over.

Of course my comments was not for you Olivie.
I mean that the members of ex and new BoD fight every time. I mean that the next BoD must work without to explain decisions of past.
It is very possible if Heinz Pierro Stefano Vincent Silvio Alan Thossa Fred relected for every new decision to hear comments for ex decisions.
Maybe a new beggining by point 0 is better after this year.

kechris wrote:I am sorry Oliv but i will agree with De Francesco comments.
You organise a fantastic tournament with the best players in world in a small city of Belgium but the toilets are not good enough.
And the afternoon many players are drunk and drinking around the tables.

I played twice in past and i hope to take part again in Mons at future.
I am sure that you will solve these simple problems.

To sum up Mons at these points is ridiculous. More than 250 players come each year. Why if it's so bad ? A lot of players come back every year because they know that sport aspects will be high quality.
This year we have built 48 new tables and bought 48 new pitches. This (and the new formula) in order that most of the players will play more games.

We know our problems. Sport hall are not enough in Belgium. Thus it's difficult to get one for 3 days.
We hope that it's the last time we'll play in that hall. We could already have changed this year but we would have to change the date. And as we know that some people buy very early their flight ticket, we decided not to change. Toilets are clean on the morning. But there are not enough for 300 people who are in the venue for all the day.

About your other point, I can assure you that we'll insist to all players to avoid to bring beers inside play areas.

Again, I don't like to speak on forum. But I had to answer to Piero because his question was important. I have very important personal problems and the rest of my time, I spend it for the Major.
If someone wants to continue the discussion, he can send me a e-mail.

oli wrote:
This year we have built 48 new tables and bought 48 new pitches. This (and the new formula) in order that most of the players will play more games.
CONGRATULATIONS. YOU WANT TO ORGANISE THE BEST TOURNAMENT.

We know our problems.
Toilets are clean on the morning. But there are not enough for 300 people who are in the venue for all the day.
YOU KNOW THE PROBLEM SO MY COMMENT IS NOT UNFAIR.

About your other point, I can assure you that we'll insist to all players to avoid to bring beers inside play areas.
THE SAME. YOU KNOW THE PROBLEM SO MY COMMENT IS NOT UNFAIR.

I have very important personal problems and the rest of my time, I spend it for the Major.
If someone wants to continue the discussion, he can send me a e-mail.
I DON'T WANT TO DISTURB YOU. YOU HAVE ONLY 5 WEEKS. GOOD LUCK.

Heinz Eder wrote:
Your problem is that you already build your opinion when you only hear names and you are a person who won't change his opinion again.

I DON'T CHANGE EASY MY OPINION BECAUSE I SPEND MANY TIME TO HAVE AN OPINION FOR THE MATTERS. I AM HAPPY BECAUSE YOU ACCEPT THAT I DON'T CHANGE OPINION EVERY WEEK.
I THINK THAT EVERYBODY NEEDS A SECOND EFFORT.
VINCENT WANTS TO BE SPORT DIRECTOR OR COMMUNICATION DIRECTOR AND ONE MONTH BEFORE EGM HE WROTES IN FORUM "PERSONA NON GRATA" FOR DE FRANCESCO. IT WAS A BIG MISTAKE FOR UNITY.
EVERYBODY (MEMBERS OF LAST BoD) FIGHTS IN FORUMS. I THINK THAT IF YOU SPEND YOUR TIME IN EGM TO FIND WHO HAD RIGHT AND WHO HAD NOT RIGHT YOU WILL FORGET THE FUTURE.
BoD CANN'T CHANGE THE PAST BUT CAN CREATE THE FUTURE.
YOU WILL DO ELECTIONS, NO COURT TO FIND WHO IS MORE GUILTY. I WANT ELECTIONS FOR THE GAME NO FOR YOUR PERSONAL PROBLEMS.
IT IS SO SIMPLE...

I don't understand why you think I have personal problems!?
I didn't say that you should change your opinion every week, but in my opinion you can't make a difference between different situations.
I'm not interested to show that the previous board was much better than the current one, if my help is needed I'm ready to help for the future, if not then not.
You are always talking about the past, if you read your posts and don't trust that people maybe learnt something and can do it better in future, that's what I meant when I wrote you don't give anybody a second chance, because you can't forget the past.
This is simple.

kechris wrote:

oli wrote:
This year we have built 48 new tables and bought 48 new pitches. This (and the new formula) in order that most of the players will play more games.
CONGRATULATIONS. YOU WANT TO ORGANISE THE BEST TOURNAMENT.

We know our problems.
Toilets are clean on the morning. But there are not enough for 300 people who are in the venue for all the day.
YOU KNOW THE PROBLEM SO MY COMMENT IS NOT UNFAIR.

About your other point, I can assure you that we'll insist to all players to avoid to bring beers inside play areas.
THE SAME. YOU KNOW THE PROBLEM SO MY COMMENT IS NOT UNFAIR.

I have very important personal problems and the rest of my time, I spend it for the Major.
If someone wants to continue the discussion, he can send me a e-mail.
I DON'T WANT TO DISTURB YOU. YOU HAVE ONLY 5 WEEKS. GOOD LUCK.

Heinz Eder wrote:
Your problem is that you already build your opinion when you only hear names and you are a person who won't change his opinion again.

I DON'T CHANGE EASY MY OPINION BECAUSE I SPEND MANY TIME TO HAVE AN OPINION FOR THE MATTERS. I AM HAPPY BECAUSE YOU ACCEPT THAT I DON'T CHANGE OPINION EVERY WEEK.
I THINK THAT EVERYBODY NEEDS A SECOND EFFORT.
VINCENT WANTS TO BE SPORT DIRECTOR OR COMMUNICATION DIRECTOR AND ONE MONTH BEFORE EGM HE WROTES IN FORUM "PERSONA NON GRATA" FOR DE FRANCESCO. IT WAS A BIG MISTAKE FOR UNITY.
EVERYBODY (MEMBERS OF LAST BoD) FIGHTS IN FORUMS. I THINK THAT IF YOU SPEND YOUR TIME IN EGM TO FIND WHO HAD RIGHT AND WHO HAD NOT RIGHT YOU WILL FORGET THE FUTURE.
BoD CANN'T CHANGE THE PAST BUT CAN CREATE THE FUTURE.
YOU WILL DO ELECTIONS, NO COURT TO FIND WHO IS MORE GUILTY. I WANT ELECTIONS FOR THE GAME NO FOR YOUR PERSONAL PROBLEMS.
IT IS SO SIMPLE...

Heinz Eder wrote:
You are always talking about the past, if you read your posts and don't trust that people maybe learnt something and can do it better in future, that's what I meant when I wrote you don't give anybody a second chance, because you can't forget the past.

You failed as sport director. What change the last year? You were fan and assistant of the next sport director who also he failed. You didn't accept ever you mistakes in past. So why you asked a second chance?
I prefer to give a chance (if i vote) to Lenz to Luis Felippe or Drastis or Chragg or Vesa or Tilgner or Corsten or Lauder or Antonello or many others. Maybe if they took a chance to find a good director between all of them.
I thought that Vincent learnt by his mistakes. But he did a big one yesterday for DeFrancesco so i think that he will do more mistakes in future.
I prefer another candidate by Belgium. Maybe Vanton or other with good english.

Those are my personal opinions.

Kostas, i'm fed up with De Francesco because he's a liar. He's telling lies to many people to influence them and I'm tird of it. Stefano is a cheater and someone who does not care for unity. He's always working for his own interests and he doesn't care about democracy.

Ins eptember, he threatened that Italy would leave FISTF if there were elections in Rain( and of course nobody had the balls to have electiosn anyway) and now he's the guy who's telling who should do what in the next Board. Who the hell is he to say who is good to run FISTF? Last year he wanted to become sports director and it was a total failure.

Ont he italian forum, he wrote what the former Boards did and he only wrote the negative points (some were not really the fault of the Board members) just like if the former Board was just shit (because SdF is perfect, in case you don't know it).

With a bit more humility, he would also stop telling everywhere that Mons is a very bad tournament. he even wrote something like "in italy, it wouldn't even be an Open". Sorry but if Mons is the tournament with the biggest number off oreign players for many years, it's because it's a fantastic tournament, perfectly run by Olivier's team and because there is a great spirit.

Sorry if in Belgium we don't have great halls to play. Either they are extremely expensive or they are just not available because the priority always goes to basket-ball, volley-ball, futsal,... but we do with what we have and until a few people pointed out (and insisted) about it, it was not a problem.

I don't have to be sorry for what I said to De Francesco. In the last 16 months, he has been the biggest trouble-maker in FISTF and everybody seems to forget it. It's time for him to retire and to apologize for being the biggest enemy of FISTF.

It is always a risk when people write in a forum what they think about each other. No question. And it is always a thin line between not to insult and critzise, between spreading wrong information and lying. That´s why a lot of people just follow what´s written in forums, but not write themselves.

Both, Vincent and Stefano are very offensive and brave in writting there opinions, without fear of the risk.

I want bring back the memories to Stefanos attacks from 2010 here in this forum against me, my work and what worst association in Germany is.

Remember? Words, words, words....

Lots of non-germans jump beside us and wonder why he is continuesly is doing this. Well, finally we proved: it wasn´t a bad World Cup, the german association can not be so bad, when two champions stood on top and now, different people wanted to see me coming back in three different FISTF-positions.

Well, that german story seems to be over now for Stefano de Francesco, but it left a bad smack. The consequences out of it is, in Germany he certainly is not a persona non grata, but nearly everyone don´t like him anymore.

History repeats. As some people probably have notice, Vincent wrote what the Belgians are thinking about the way how De Francesco is acting. Vincent is not alone in his view!

Ask yourself: Which country will be his next enemy for De Francesco? England, France, The Netherlands, Finland?